Brand Your Practice Podcast

So all right, today's topic. All right. Welcome

to the Brand Your Practice podcast. And in

today's topic, we're going to talk about

telling better stories to get more clients.

The three things we're going to be focusing

on are why storytelling is key to effective

marketing. how to fit more clients, more

stories into your marketing and where to

find the stories you tell. Inspiration is

everywhere. So how to find those stories

to tell. And so we'll be geeking out around

story and answering your questions. And I

think this is going to be really important

for you as practice owners, as business owners,

because the way you can lodge yourself, your

brand into somebody's brain is by telling

a compelling story. And there's a formula

for those things. And we'll probably get

into some formulaic storytelling. But it's

going to be really important for your brand

moving forward. Okay. But before we go in,

our sponsor, our presenting sponsor is TheraSaaS.

And many of you know TheraSaaS. It's a powerful

intake CRM. You know, your If you are tired

of Post-it Notes, if you're tired of Excel

spreadsheets and all the color codedness

of those, and clients are still falling through

the cracks, TheraSaaS could actually be a

helpful CRM for you. All you do is put a

simple TheraSaaS form on your website, and

then that's gonna be put into that contact,

will be put into the visual pipeline here,

so you know where everyone is at in the journey

in becoming a paying client, so that no one's

falling through the cracks. And that's just

the tip of the iceberg. There's a lot of

automations that you can use to do those

repetitive tasks all the time. You just automate

those. You'll get real time analytics for

a dashboard. So you always know the health

of your sales and marketing initiatives.

So if you, if that's you and you're listening

and you're watching, go over to therasaas.com

and schedule a demo to see if it's a good

fit for you. All right, the other thing I

want you to know about, if you're a Group

Practice owner, we have the Group Practice

Scaling Summit in Chicago, the first weekend

in May, May 1 and May 2. It's a Thursday

and Friday. This is our second year doing

it. Last year was a wonderful success. And

the idea behind this is this. You went to

graduate school to become amazing clinicians,

but they did not teach you how to be business

owners in graduate school. So this is all

around being tactical as it relates to marketing,

your operations, and your finances. So we're

going to be talking about branding and marketing.

We're going to talking about competitive

pay structures to retain clinicians. Actually,

there's a lot around retaining clinicians

this year, how to manage and creating a culture

so that clinicians want to stay around and

be working for you. And we also have Allison

Pidgeon coming and she's gonna be talking

about how to build wealth by owning your

building. Maybe you want to be a real estate

owner as it comes to owning the practice

that you are working in or just owning property

and how to build wealth that way. So again,

business, it's all about business. No fluff,

all tactical. It's great. OK, so here we

are. Jane Carter is a therapist-turned-business

coach for solopreneurs who want to go out

of, who want to get out of their own, their

own way and to make more money and have more

fun in the process. She loves helping therapists

and other solopreneurs put their business

on the couch so they can find joy and purpose

as they serve their clients. have a business

aligned with their values and personality,

and find themselves saying, I can't believe

I get paid so well to do work I love so much.

She lives in Asheville, North Carolina, where

she's an outdoors woman, craft beer snob,

and a local foodie. And I met Jane at the

Y Summit with Whitney Owens, and I sat in

her let's say, the breakout session on telling

stories. And since I'm a former StoryBrand

Certified Guide Coach thing, and I was, I

was compelled to sit in, and she had a lot

of great things to say. And I was like, I'd

love to have you on my podcast. So welcome.

Welcome, Jane. Good to have you.

I am so happy to be here. Thank you so much

for having me. I didn't know that you were

a story band friend guide. That's awesome.

Yeah, I was it for five years.

I was great. I learned the whole storytelling

angle. That's great.

I would say it was the number one thing,

uh, framework, whatever you want to call

it, that, scaled every single practice that

I helped start around my clients. Branding,

all of it. That whole framework worked. It

worked for all my businesses that I've started.

Because you need a framework. Therapists

need a framework on how people change, right?

Using different modalities to kind of help

support that framework. The same thing with

with sales and marketing, like you need a

framework in order to organize all of that

in your system. So story is the best way

to do it, I think. And it's the most fun.

It is the most fun. And it we really are

wired for it. I mean, I really I'm a fan

of story brand. And I appreciate the ways

that they've elevated the craft of story,

or even just the concept of using stories

and marketing and using that, yeah, again,

it's a framework overall, but we are so wired

for stories. I mean, there are those cave

paintings from 40,000 years ago that they

found where, I mean, people, early humans

would sit around and tell stories. That's

how we, congeal information, that's how we

connect to others. I think the statistic

is we are 22 times more likely to recall

information that we've learned through a

story versus just hearing a list of information.

When people hear a story, they light up,

their attention gets refocused.

Yeah. And also the parts of the brain that

want to throw objections, object, object,

object, object, the brain, storytelling actually

allows the brain to relax enough. And you

can then engage someone and that you can

still address those objections, whatever

they might have. I'm a sucker for a good

story. You know, I mean, like, like, that's

why we love the movies.

Right. Exactly. Exactly. And I'm a, I'm a,

um, podcast fiend and I love, I mean, I just

absorbed so many podcasts and the ones that

I'm always drawn to are things like the moth

or this American life or ones where they,

they craft great stories or even interview

shows where people are coming on and telling

their story. It just breaks through in a

way that data and information just doesn't

doesn't land. Yeah.

I was just, I was just going to say this

and then I'll, I'll let you jump in. No,

no, no. That's great. Survivor. I have to

look at how many seasons survivor, you know,

47 seasons and That's all around storytelling.

You got individual personalities, you know

what they want. There's all these objections.

There's all these obstacles, sorry, obstacles

away from what they want. And they leave

cliffhangers at the end of the episode. Those

open loops. And your brain's like, I need

to know. And so I will wait a week. I'll

wait a week and then I'll come back. Right.

That's storytelling.

That's storytelling. Well, that's why we

all binge Netflix because they leave that

open loop at the end. And then we were like,

but I've got to complete the story. And I

know we're getting into sort of the technique

part in a way, but I just cannot emphasize

enough. And here's the thing. I mean, the

people that we're talking to are therapists.

I mean, what we're doing is holding sacred

space for people to tell their stories, right?

Like, I think therapists don't even realize

that they are uniquely positioned to be better

marketers. They tend to think of themselves

as not being cut out for marketing or, oh,

it's sleazy or, you know. And I think one

of the reasons I love talking about storytelling

in general is that you can sort of reframe

it as, no, no, no, let's just think of it

as finding places and ways to tell stories.

And and to kind of take that listening to

stories ability and shifted into. Okay. And

then how can I tell those stories? I mean,

tell people's personal info, but like, how

can I craft a good story? Uh. I also kind

of picture, I think in metaphor, cause I'm

a therapist. I just picture like cramming

a story into every little nook and cranny

that you can, like you're packing a suitcase

just like, or a, or a potted plant. Like

how can I cram as many stories into every

inch of my marketing as possible? Because

it makes such a big difference in terms of

helping people understand the value of what

you do. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So I'll turn it over to you. Go ahead. I

know we got those three points we wanted

to get to. Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

For those who are here live, throw some questions

in too as well along the way. We'd love to

answer them.

Okay. Yeah. And let me know if questions

pop up. I do have the chat up, but I'm not

good at dividing my attention.

Okay.

And feel free to jump in too, because I can

be a bit of a rambler. Okay. So yeah. So,

okay. So first of all, just, Training your

brain to be thinking about where can I tell

more stories? How can I structure more of

my marketing in a story format? That's a

really important part of this because our

brains light up. I mean, as you said, our

brains are more receptive when we hear a

story. It engages the emotional part of our

brain as well as the information part. Like,

if we're just getting a list of information

and data, it lights up one part of the brain.

If you're hearing a story, It lights up so

much more of the brain. We're just so much

more present. We are storytelling machines

and story hearing machines. And it really

becomes a shorthand for the emotional side

of whatever it is that we're trying to teach.

So again, if you're trying to help people

understand the value of therapy, or understand

what's possible for them, or understand why

there's objections to therapy, trying to

help them understand the value of this work.

What it ends up doing is just it's again

of metaphors. I'm just picturing we turn

into a sponge. We're just we become very

porous where we're able to receive that information,

right? And the secret reason that I love

to encourage therapists and other helpers

to focus on storytelling is that. There's

a shift in you, right? When you are telling

a story about the value of what you do, or

if you're telling a story, like a success

story with a client, or you're telling your

why story, here's how I got into doing this

work, right, and why that's important. When

you are telling a story, you are, first of

all, you're reminding yourself of the value

of it. You know, you're starting to go, oh,

this is amazing. This is really important.

This is really meaningful to me. And as you're

kind of, what's the word, distilling it into

words, into a really good, like you're crafting

a good story, you're creating a really clear

marketing message. you're starting to tighten

up that story and you're starting to go,

Oh, like these are the reframes. These are

the, okay. It's not just a bunch of details.

There's, there's a deeper story in here of

the strengths that I'm bringing to this and

the transformation that I help people have.

And that makes you feel really good, right?

Right.

Yeah, oh yeah. Therapists can be really insecure,

and I think having a few stories about their

work, right? And they hate talking about

themselves. Because as you were saying that,

I'm like, there's a couple, and you might

get into this, but to kind of maybe foreshadow

a little bit for our listeners, is that therapists

have key opportunities to share a few stories

in the most important parts of the therapeutic

process. It's probably somewhere on your,

the first one's gonna be on your website,

having a video or something talking about

how you help people and you're uniquely situated

to help people. The second one is in that

initial conversation. Maybe it's in the first

session, the intake, or maybe it's on the

phone, where you might need to have a story

or two that positions yourself as that trusted

guide. because they're coming to you with

that most intimate problem. And you can say

something like, I've helped many people in

your position, and this is how I do it. So

there's a story there, or you could share

a story of how you've maybe helped a couple

people in that particular, and what the outcomes

might have looked like. And then I think

there's another one that's really important,

is maybe as you're wrapping up, as you're

wrapping up service, and you're getting ready

to terminate that client, to be able to recap

their journey, story form, as a way to kind

of close out and bring that ending. To me,

that's kind of how I think of like 3 really

kind of important parts. But the 2 most important

ones are really in the beginning of that

review.

Absolutely.

Marketing stage as they are wondering if

they can trust you.

Yeah, absolutely. And You mentioned something

like therapists, we often don't like to talk

about ourselves. I mean, I was just talking

to a coaching client who was like, I just,

I want to talk about how great this is, but

I don't want to turn into a narcissist. I

was like, I'm really not worried about that

for you.

Most narcissists aren't actually worried.

Exactly.

Exactly. But what they're, the reframe we

kept doing, I was like, Anne, you being able

to tell the story of transformation, you

being able to tell what's possible, you being

able to say, here's why this is awesome,

that is a service to the other person, right?

And again, it kind of takes us out of our

ego a little bit when we just go, I'm just

telling stories. I'm just telling stories.

I'm just recounting what's happened. I'm

recounting how I got from there to here.

I'm recounting how my client got from here

to here. I'm recounting how I ended up in

my specialty. That's all I'm doing. I'm just

telling stories. And I remember telling this

at the Wise Practice Summit. And there is,

again, the more we retell a story, the more

we start to find the little nuggets of gold.

And the more we kind of start to find the

overstory of it, Oh, and here's the theme

of that story. This is, again, I'm not just

recounting details. I'm finding a theme in

this. And we see this with our clients, right?

We get them to tell their stories. Often,

it can be helpful to have them retell and

retell and retell the story. I know the FOA

technique is a trauma treatment. Oh, what's

the other one called? Pennebaker. Anyway,

they have people tell their trauma story

over and over and over again, and then they

start to find the reframe. The client starts

to find the shift from the victim to the

survivor reframe. And the story that I love,

I heard this years ago, there was a little

boy and his mother said, hey, we can go to

the toy store and you can pick out And it

was around Halloween and they had this giant

Frankenstein's monster cut out at the entrance

to the toy store. And it just terrified him.

He just went into a full trauma response.

You know, screamed, we gotta get out of there,

we gotta get out of there. And she heard

him just processing the experience over and

over again. He said, hey mom, remember we

went to the toy store and we walked in the

door and there was a Frankenstein and it

terrified me and I screamed and we left.

And she's like, uh-huh, I remember. And he

said, remember, remember that time we went

to the toy store? Like he kept telling it

and telling it. And she just let him tell

the story. And then at some point he was

telling the story and he said, you know,

there was a Frankenstein's monster And then

I peed on it. And he even made up a detail

that wasn't true to this story, but it put

him in a more empowered place. And he was

no longer scared to go back to the toy store.

Something happens when we retell a story.

And this is one reason I love to tell my

clients to have a signature story. And again,

that might be your why, your origin story.

You know, if we think about movies or, um,

your origin story or your, your, here's how

I got into this. Usually it's because we

were helped by a therapist or by someone

else. Um, but it can be something else. It

could be a key moment in your journey. So

like I, I have a client who, She has a happy

marriage, but now she's a divorce counselor

because she was working in the school counseling

center, and all these children with behavior

problems whose parents were getting divorced,

she realized, you know, it's not that the

child necessarily needs an intervention.

It's that the more I talk to the parents,

the calmer and more grounded the parents

become, and then the children's behavior

problems go away. So that's how she found

her specialty is helping children and working

with divorced, sorry, working with divorced

parents to help children. So that's a signature

story. You know, I got tired, like that last

kid who came in and I realized I needed to

talk to the parents instead of the child.

That was the moment. Does that make sense?

Yeah, yeah. And that goes to, like, your

personal branding. I'm going to be talking

about that at the Summit Group Practice Gala

on personal branding. And you kind of need

a story to tell, right? Again, we're talking

about how do people remember you. And usually,

you want to lead, you lead your story with

the problem. I had this problem.

I had it.

So I start off, I typically start my origin

story. And I've said it a lot now, you know,

but it's, it starts off with, you know, eight

years ago, my wife came home, she was getting

her internship hours where she was working.

And she's like, Brent, when I'm fully licensed,

I want to start my own private practice.

Problem is, I've never started a business.

I've never done branding and marketing before.

We had three kids under three. Well, one

was on the way. We were living in Chicago.

And so we had to make this work in order

to like live by family. We wanted, you know,

so I set the stakes up, but that was the

problem. I wasn't being fake. Those are all

very real things. And then I set it up. And

when I started telling it, I actually, you

know, I would get to end of my presentation.

And the main question would be like, well,

Brent, what happened? But I never closed

that story loop that I opened. Part of my

urgent story is I close it, and then I move

on. And I said, This is now what I'm doing

with this. But I think with every, you know,

your personal, you start with the problem,

kind of like where you were, and that usually

that was because someone helped you, right?

Now you want to help others. I was in this

difficult, dark place, or I was confused,

and I couldn't get through. Then somebody

came along. And, and now I want to help others

in the same way. So I think, yeah, that's

a really easy structure to think about your

own story. And there's ways you can nuance

it more, but that's kind of what we're talking

about.

Well, and you're describing the hero's journey,

right? Which, again, Donald Miller and StoryBrand,

they do a great job of tapping into the hero's

journey. But Joseph Campbell, this mythologist

amazing human, he identified, hey, we're

really telling the same few stories over

and over again. There's a general structure.

And there's the problem, if the hero has

a problem, kind of the flip side of that

is the hero longs for something. It could

be a result that they long for. And those

can be flip sides of the same coin, right?

And they have to leave their comfort zone.

They meet a guide. You're the story brand

guide, so if I leave out any elements.

No, you're great. You're great.

They meet a guide who has a plan. So I'll

talk to clients about, you are the... the

Dumbledore to your client's Harry Potter.

You have a process, you have a plan. There

are stakes. It could go badly or it could

go well. Or I love to talk about Star Wars.

You're the Obi-Wan Kenobi, right? So use

the force, that's the plan. That leads to

either success or failure. Failure is the

stakes, success is It's success, getting

the thing they want and solving the problem,

but also there's that aspirational identity.

It's helping them become someone in the process.

And again, there's this parallel thing I

think about where we are helping our clients

transform into someone new. It's who they're

becoming, or it's mining for who they truly

are, right? But also, we're becoming someone

in the process. And the stories we tell shape

us. And so, again, there can be something

healing about telling your brand story. I

was struggling with this. I had a great therapist

who helped me see the ways that I was You

know, I didn't have a clear view of myself

or I was overcoming this trauma or, you know,

and then I, I came out on the other side

and I'm able to help other people. The more

we tell the story and we nuance it and we,

we focus in on like certain key moments.

Oh my goodness. There's healing and joy that

comes with being able to tell a great brand

story too.

Yeah. And I'll say this before we maybe move

on to the marketing side. How do you fit

stories in your marketing? There's two things.

One, and Jean has a question that I'll share

in a second. You have to remember, we see

ourselves in our own hero's journey. We see

ourselves in a story. That's how we organize

our world. And your clients see themselves

in the story. So when you tell your story,

you don't want to have it where it's like,

uh, you know, I'm still struggling with all

these things. Like I haven't even figured

it out yet. Right. They're not looking for

a therapist who hasn't figured it all out

yet. Right. They were actually looking for

someone who's, you know, has a pretty good

handle on how to help them. Right. Right.

Um, so if you ever tell your story, you want

to talk about how you were, had been able

to overcome. But you don't want to make it

about you unless it's going to help show

yourself as a trusted guide because the person

who's coming to you has a problem and they're

looking for a trusted guide and they want

to know if they can trust you. So your story

as relates to your brand story and your marketing

has to be around the ways you help people,

not that you're still on your journey in

the desert trying to find what you're looking

for. Okay.

Can I, can I jump in on that? And I know

we have, I feel like I'm going a little bit

all over the place. Um, and I'm, I'm working

on, I'll, I'll have a freebie available for

people soon by the end of the week, um, about

crafting your signature story and building

your story bank. And I put some tips for

storytelling. And one of the things you want

to keep in mind when you're telling a story

is you want to have that balance of vulnerability

as well as credibility. right? Or empathy

and authority. So you don't want to like

you, yes, you want to tell your story and

share some of your vulnerability, but you

don't want to bleed all over them and go

on and on about how like all the most gory

details and, and especially if you're still

in it, you know, and I'm still a mess and

isn't that great. You can relate to me. No,

no, no. Now it's still about me versus, And

through this work and through the work I've

continued to do to help people, here's what

I understand and what I'm able to keep guiding

people through. That there's credibility,

there's authority, as well as, yes, you are

a human being.

Jane, can I put you on the spot? Gene had

a question. I would appreciate hearing a

story specifically from start to end. So

I'm curious if you might, that could be your

own brand story, or maybe it's a story of

one of your clients that you might be able

to like, this is the problem they had, and

just kind of walk them through kind of start

to end of what that transformation will look,

just to give them example.

Yeah, OK. Ooh, I am on the spot. And it's

so funny. I was thinking about this. I was

like, I should be telling this whole thing

through a series of stories. And I haven't

revisited my own signature story in a while.

So one of my tips for telling a story is

don't ramble. So heads up, if I ramble, I

apologize ahead of time. I have a couple

of signature stories I like to come back

to. I will say I okay and this is about coaching

so I I was a successful therapist I had started

my practice it was thriving I really wanted

to add coaching And at the time, this was

like 10 years ago, everything was, oh, just

plug into this formula. You'll have a big

online audience. You want to scale. It's

all about scaling and starting memberships.

And just plug into the formula, and you're

going to be a millionaire. Anyway, I was

like, well, OK, let me learn this formula.

What I'm picturing is working one-on-one

with people, but everyone says you need to

scale. You've got to scale. You've got to

scale. So I tried the formula. I tried to

start this huge membership-based scaled program

and it was totally overwhelming. I didn't

know what I was doing. It completely fell

flat and I was so sad and so dejected. I

have never, I don't think I've ever felt

that much like a failure. I had a lot of

dreams attached to it and at first the belief

I took was I suck at this. I'm not cut out

for this. I'm not even cut out for doing

any kind of business. And I decided to comfort

myself by going to my favorite coffee shop

and grabbing a donut and just eating and

caffeinating my feelings. And I ran into

a friend. She saw my face and just opened

her arms and gave me a hug. And I just sobbed.

I like snot cried onto her shoulder and I

told her what happened. And she reminded

me, you know, Jane, Do you remember last

year when I moved to Colorado for a guy and

I sold my house, I closed my business, I

said goodbye to all my therapy clients and

the relationship fell apart. She's like,

it's okay. It's okay to fail. You're going

to be okay. And it was a really transformational

moment because I was like, you know what?

I am going to be okay. It's okay to make

mistakes. It's okay to, take imperfect action.

Um, so in my, you know, snotty puffy eyed

face, I literally had had a colleague reach

out to me and say, Hey, can we hop on the

phone for an hour for some coaching? Um,

and I, I got in the car and I just, I lied

and told him I had a cold and I coached him

and it was, it was great. We had this great

one-on-one session as I was like, you know,

grabbing like food bags to wipe my face,

you know, we're over the phone and, And I

also, so from doing this, I had all this

debt because I'd, I'd bought the website

and the, all the marketing channels and all

the domains and all that stuff. And I didn't

have a way to pay back my members who had

joined and, and I had a great coach and she

said, Jane, why don't you offer them one-on-one

coaching instead of a refund? And so I did,

and it turned out I loved one-on-one coaching.

I was great at one-on-one coaching. And that

was the beginning of my current business

where I do business coaching one-on-one with

people. So the lessons from that, failure

is okay. In fact, you have to make, I always

say you have to make first pancakes, right?

You've got to make that mushy or burnt pancake

to get that perfect second or third pancake.

The other thing is just self-compassion.

You've got to have self-compassion in this

process, right? And the third, and this is

one that I've really drawn more in telling

the story, it actually has evolved to, and

actually the main thing is don't try to build

a business that isn't the one you want to

have. When you do the, well, here's the should

business, the one I should have, you shoot

yourself in the foot. I should have done

the, I knew the business I wanted in the

first place, but I shoulded on myself. And

that process, my business was looking out

for me, and through this horrible experience,

it guided me to this is what you're meant

to do. Ta-da! There's my signature story.

Yeah, and for those listening, you know,

Jane started with what she wanted, and what

she thought she wanted, right?

Or what others told me I wanted.

Yeah, you should have, I should want this,

I should want this, right? And then others

told you, and then you had the setup and

you had the failure, right? And the fallout

from that. I love some of your descriptions,

snotty, snot crying. I made pancakes this

morning too for my kids. So that was very

visual. And then like the guy, the friend

came along, spoke a kind word, you know,

I failed. In some ways, maybe I failed even

harder than you, and you're going to be,

you know, you're going to be OK. And then

you saw that transformational journey, like

what it looks like afterwards, and it was

OK. So yeah, it's a beautiful story. And

I was even drawn into it in those moments.

I'm like, oh, this is so good. Forgetting

the fact that this was actually an object

lesson. You know what I mean? But that's

the power story. And I'm sure some of everyone

else, others would listening and watching

the same way. So thank you for that.

Yeah, pleasure.

All right, well, let's talk about, we have

a couple, what point do you want to jump

into? How to fit more stories in your marketing

or where to find stories you tell or in some

inspiration or put together?

Yeah, so I mean, let me talk about, let's

talk about where to, where to use stories.

I, so I do email marketing. I always start

with a story and I, you know, it's interesting.

As soon as I started, jumping off all of

my emails with a story before doing whatever

the lesson of the newsletter was. Within

a few weeks, I started having people say,

Jane, your emails are the only ones I read.

I love your emails. I love them. I love them.

I love getting that feedback. And the main

change I made was I'm always putting in a

story. So again, it speaks to the brain.

Jim Collison, MSWordDoc Word.Document.8

I typically do like an anecdotal story.

Okay.

So I'll hear a fun or interesting story and

I'll be like, that's a great, that's a great

story. I don't even know what the lesson

or metaphor from that is going to be. I'm

turning, I'm putting that in a story and

then I'm going to connect it to what I do.

So the structure is great story segue, you

know, and why is that important or what does

that have to do with, a therapy practice,

you know, a little segue, and then jumping

into, so here are the lessons I want you

to draw from this, and then the call to action

of, hey, hit reply and tell me what you got

from that, or hit reply and tell me how you

applied it to your business, that kind of

thing. Yeah, yeah, but other people, yeah,

they'll do the sort of the larger framework

of what's the client's problem, or the thing

that they want, you know, or focus on any

of those elements, right? What are the stakes

of not getting therapy or what does it mean

to be a guide? to the hero, that kind of

thing. So yeah, okay, so stories, gosh, they

can go in blogs, they can go in, like, I

didn't do this today, but it's great to start

any sort of presentation or workshop that

you do with a story. That immediately draws

people in. And when we were at Wise Practice,

I realized, oh, I'm talking about story,

and I don't have a story. And I was like,

well, I just left Hurricane Ravaged Asheville.

I was still very shaky. And I think I teared

up when I did this. But I opened a story

loop. And I started with, the wind started

blowing. And then I just started talking.

And I was like, all right, I told a little

story about how do I make coffee before the

electricity goes off. But I invited others

to close the story loop. it's great to start

a workshop or any presentation you do with

a story. And even if you're networking and

someone's like, so what do you do? I'm a

therapist. Oh, cool. If you can frame it,

you can tell a story about, well, so for

instance, I had a client come in the other

day with this type of thing and we did this

and now they're able to go into these places

that they used to be afraid of, you know,

it can be a hero's journey, like before,

during and after.

Yeah. That's a, that you could talk about.

Um, cause people have done that and I've

tested this out, like at blog, they're like,

what do you do? And I go into my origin story

and I make it really short cause there's

kids running around and it's chaotic, but

like you could do that like a really short,

you know, a client came in the other day,

I'm a therapist and the client came in the

other day.

Yeah.

This, yeah. problem. And you can just whatever

be really general. And then you could end

it like, and that's why I love doing therapy.

Yes, I get to help people. So that's why

I do. And like, they will never ever forget

what you do.

Yeah, yeah. You can do it. Yeah, exactly.

You can do, and metaphors are another, they're

kind, they're not a story per se, but they're

visual. So you can also say something like,

It's random, but like I'm a soul plumber.

A what? I help people plumb the depths and

get unclogged from their problems. But you

can incite curiosity or create something

that it's a visual story through a metaphor.

Or even just the difference between saying,

you know, I am a therapist. I do internal

family systems. Versus, you know, I I take

clients who are feeling this way and I use

this process called IFS to help them feel

This way more aligned more alive, you know,

like there's a before during and after even

in that little phrase Yeah, and or you could

do

let's say you specialize like in working

with kids and divorce or something. You can

be like, you know how there's a lot of parents

who get divorced and they're really concerned

about how their kids are going to turn out

because there's, there's a lot of fighting

and they, but deep down they not, they're

like, they don't want to mess them up. Well,

I actually, I'm a child therapist, and I

specialize in health. You know what I'm saying?

They will never, ever forget. They'll never

forget.

And they can picture it. They're picturing

it in their mind as you are describing that.

And that's, again, you're helping them create

a story in their minds. So I love that. And

actually, OK, so speaking of, oh, wait, let

me talk, sorry, there's so much more to talk

about.

I was going to say, well, marketing is really

helping other people memorize what you do.

Yes, exactly.

And remember what you do, right? So go ahead.

That's kind of... Yeah, yeah. And that's

the thing. If they're visualizing it, then

it's like, that's like... Here's another

metaphor. It's like Velcro, like there's

all these little hooks, you know, like that

visual and every story you tell, it's like

a little hook in the Velcro where it's sticky.

It sticks to their brain.

Right. And that's the way the brain's designed,

right? Like it's going to remember that because

they're going to be like, maybe I'm going

to need that information later. Or, Oh, I

know a friend who's really struggling with

this and they could actually use that kind

of, the brain's constantly thinking about

how do they like not get into trouble or

how do I get out of trouble?

Yes.

How do I avoid trouble and pain?

Yes, exactly. So one thing, I'm going to

skip forward and then skip backwards in my

order of how I was going to talk about this.

Okay.

Okay. Because I'm so visual. Y'all can see

me doing a lot of this. So You know that

you remarked on when I was telling my origin

story That the snotty nose and the puffy

eyes right and even like I'm picturing myself

like reaching for the doughnut like When

you're practicing telling your stories throw

in little concrete details and specifics

Yes That also makes it sticky. It adds little

Velcro hooks to their brain. It becomes so

much more visual.

Yeah, that's a good. I used to do that. I

had this one thing on my origin story where

I was like I was in my front yard. The leaves

were falling off the tree and I was just

raking leaves. These big piles of brown and

yellow leaves. My twin little girls were

just jumping in and enjoying it and loving

it. And I was thinking about how in the world

are we gonna start this practice so we can

provide for our kids? but those are, you

know, but that, that idea of like the, the

leaves falling and examining, that's exactly

what I was at, which is those little details,

those little details. And there, and people

are like, I'm with you. I'm with you. Exactly.

Put in sensory details. You know, it's one

thing to say, Oh, I became a therapist because,

you know, I struggled with depression as

a teenager and my therapist really helped

me. And now I get to help others. It's another

thing to say, you know, I wore nothing but

sweatpants and, would cry until there was

no tears that would come out of my eyes left

anymore. Or just again, just put in, I ate

nothing but Doritos for a week, whatever.

I know these are all off the top of my head.

It's that scene from Uncle Buck where he's

laying back, he's been eating Doritos and

he just gets a vacuum sucker and just starts

cleaning them off his chest. Exactly. Like

that's going to work wherever.

And even as you say that, and this is such

a segue to what I was gonna say, that is

a great little story. Something like that,

I want to glom onto that image you just presented,

Brent, and put it in one of my emails and

say, have you ever seen Uncle Buck? And he's

doing this and da-da-da. And then put a segue

to, let's relate that to, Building a business,

right? So what I want y'all to be doing,

you know, because you asked like, where do

you find stories? You know, you have your

story and we're often kind of the after of

our clients before wait to say that we're

the Yeah, we're the after of our clients

before. Like often our ideal client is some

version of us a few years ago, right? Or

decades ago. So your story, you have your

success stories or the stories that you learned

from because they were not great as you were

building your practice. But I, I am always

scanning for stories. I listen to story podcasts

and like yesterday I heard Tom Hanks tell

this great story about when he was a kid

and they used to make up plays because they

were latchkey kids you know and I was like

ran over I have paper all over my kitchen,

because in my house, I have little notepads

because I was like, I've got to write this

down before I forget it. Or I'll do a voice

note to myself. So if I hear someone just

tell a great story, I will adopt that story

because I can tell their story, but then

connect it to what I do, because it becomes

a metaphor. Or if I watch a great movie,

I quote, oh my gosh, one of my trademarks

in my emails is I'm always quoting 80s and

90s pop culture, but I love to quote 80s

movies and 90s movies, because I'm a dork.

I'm a history nerd too, so I'll tell random

fun history facts. But again, it's telling

a story. So anything, if someone tells you

a funny story, just have somewhere to collect

them before you forget them. I have just

an ongoing document on my computer where

I'm like, ooh, what's something I want to

teach and how could I connect that to that?

Because that's a hilarious story or that's

a memorable story. Stories are everywhere

and you start training your brain for it.

Yeah.

Yeah. Can I, as we're kind of starting to

wrap up a little bit, I think I want listeners

to remember good practice owners Like those

who are thinking about marketing and their

branding, they're just good storytellers.

So I think that's just, it's like a, I mean,

you're in it all the time. You're listening

to people's stories all the time. So, so

use that, use that. It's a superpower that

will help you stand out from the competition.

I promise you. I have a, go ahead.

Cause I was going to say, and again, it makes

marketing not feel sleazy. Do you know what

I mean? Cause if we're like, I got to market

myself. I got to get out there and tell some

inspiring stories. Okay. Yeah, I can do that.

This question I have here is about incorporating

humor, and I think you set a way to do this

in your workshop. But I'll let, I'm gonna

try to remember how you, but you talked about

how to do humor, but it had to do something

with like images or concrete, like metaphors.

Oh, yeah. Well, again, you know, sometimes

things like sometimes adding that specificity,

like a concrete detail. Or a brand name.

Notice I mentioned Doritos. There's a difference

between I was sad and I was crying into my

Doritos like Uncle Buck. So adding little

details and brand names and even looking

for funny words. I was really mad at him.

In my head, I was calling him Mr. Poopy Pants.

You can find, and it's a practice, it's a

skill. Listen to funny storytellers. I love

the Conan O'Brien podcast, and I love Smart

Lists, because all those guys are doing is

just being hilarious and riffing off of each

other, and it makes me funnier. I actually

say I'm not a funny person, I'm good at curating

humor.

Yeah, you I mean, you couldn't just watch.

I mean, there's so many comedian specials

out there. Like that's what they do is just

storytelling with humor, right? How do they

phrase certain things? You know, like, I

was thinking like, like, going back to the

concrete example, and like, if you're not

a very funny person, but they're gonna laugh

because they can relate, right? So like,

the idea would be, I was just feeling so

bad for myself. I just went down Main Street

hoping that the Krispy Kreme hot donut sign

was on or something like that.

Yeah, well, it's vulnerability. It's funny

because they're real right and because they're

relatable And so I think the more relatable

you're being and you know, not not being

boundaryless not bleeding all over them,

you know, but Sharing enough that they're

like, oh I can relate to that You know, then

yeah, it kind of naturally becomes funnier

because people go ha I know I totally know

that feeling and Right, right. But listening

to stories is a great way to get better at

crafting stories. So listen, I mean, again,

I mentioned The Moth. It's a podcast where

people tell their stories live, but they

do a lot of work around crafting those stories.

I just love to listen to good storytellers,

and it's made me a better storyteller.

Yeah.

Yeah, and it's made me funnier.

She said, where do I find more information,

examples of stories in addition to podcasts?

Yeah, I just go Netflix or whatever. Just

look, just look up comedians.

Oh my gosh.

Just watch comedian specials and see how

they do it. Cause that they, that is a craft

on their own. I have a bunch of people. Oh,

go ahead.

I was just saying reading. I mean, I, I became

a better therapist and a better marketer

when I started reading a lot more fiction.

Hmm.

You know, we don't, we read a lot of, you

know, psychology books and marketing books,

but go read as much fiction as you can. You

will become a better storyteller. Yeah. And,

and you'll find, again, you'll find like

great language, juicy language, as well as

little anecdotes, little ways to tell. Um,

yeah, I read fiction as a practice for marketing

and doing, being a better therapist.

Jean said, what is the name she said? What

was the name? Did you mention a name?

Oh, and the name in relation to what?

I don't know.

Give us a little more. Oh, I'm seeing your

story hour.

Maybe it was that was not a fan of humorous

ones.

Oh, the moth the moth dot com. Yeah, so it's

a. Is that the name that we're looking for?

I don't know.

She's going to have to give us a little more.

Or Conan O'Brien, or Smart List?

I just put this one up as a question. Yeah,

give us a little more, Gina. Here's another

question that someone submitted. Appropriately

weaving in story and eye towards ethics and

confidentiality. So this came up a couple

different times.

Yeah, no, that's great. That's really important,

obviously, that we don't want to give identifying

details.

That's assumed. Yeah.

And sometimes it's kind of a, you can create,

um, uh, what's the word I'm looking for?

And, uh, a condensed version of multiple

clients. Um, where if it's something that

you see a lot, um, so yeah, just use your

judgment and maybe run it by someone, but

you don't want to say, so the client that,

you know, and yeah, you don't want to say,

well, I'm not going to say who they were,

but you know, they were. six feet tall and

blonde and they worked in the, you know,

such and such administration and they had

this job, right? Like, no, you can mask details.

You can make it so that someone wouldn't

go, wait, you're talking about me. But then

again, you know, sometimes even when you

do that, you'll just have 10 people going,

you're talking about me and it's like, no,

no, no, you're my ideal client. Um, so do

the best you can. And again, appropriate

self disclosure, right? Have boundaries,

but don't, you know, you don't have to be

a robot. So,

This one is stories to attract your ideal

client. And I'll address this and I'll pass

it over to you. I still think you need to

have your website tells a story that attracts

your ideal client. I think your profile page

could have a story that addresses your ideal

client. I think those are the primary things.

And then as you're in those sales conversations,

if you're training your intake coordinators

to maybe tell stories better, or if you're

the one doing that, have a couple of pocket

stories that you might be able to use that

you've developed. that you know work well

and helping to be able to clearly communicate

how you help solve their problems.

Yeah, I tell people to have a story bank

and actually the freebie I was mentioning,

which will be up soon, I promise, probably

tomorrow, it's called the Story Bank Starter.

Um, I want, yeah, here's some questions to

answer that are, here's some stories to tell

that they're going to help you have a solid

story bank to draw from. Um, so let's see.

Oh, so to, to attract your ideal client,

I mean, I think. when you're telling stories

that resonate with the problems that they

have, the things that they want, the fears

that they're experiencing, um, the, the things

that you like, that you're good at guiding

them through, like when you're telling stories

about those things with an eye towards the

person you love to work with, then that's

what attracts them, right? Like it's in,

again, it's in the telling of the story that

you start to distill your core marketing

message. You know, when I look back at my

crying into the snotting, crying, hugging

my friend moment, I can distill, oh, wait,

here are my core marketing messages. Imperfect

action is everything. There's no shame in

failure. you're becoming someone along the

way, you know, that my business was leading

me towards something and don't do the business

that you should have, do the business that

you really desire to have. Like that's what

speaks to my ideal clients. Um, and it's

good that I had to just retell that story

because again, the more I tell it, the more

I can tighten it up and make those points.

Yeah.

So yeah.

Um, I was having a thought and I was typing

something in the thing to show. But there,

Aaron Sorkin, somebody referenced him. He's

written a ton of shows, including the West

Wing. The West Wing might be one of the best

written shows.

Oh my gosh, so good. The Walker Hux.

Newsroom, he also wrote on that. You know,

at the end of the day, if you ask if any

of these characters died off, would you be

like, It'd be hard to, you just end up loving

all these characters. They're well thought.

But he's basically is sort of like, what

is it that they want? And what's the obstacle?

So notice even Aaron Sorkin and all these

movie writers, screenwriters, they have a

formula. They have a formula. A hundred percent,

they have a formula. But it's how they play,

that's how they play. How do they develop

that problem? What are those obstacles? How

do they, how are they using language to really

grab people and draw them into the story?

So I think as we're kind of wrapping up here,

it's like, it's OK to use a formula. And

it's, there's no problem. It's really, it's

a craft. So you're not going to get the,

you're not going to be the best storyteller

right away. But you're going to do is you're

gonna have a simple formula. What is that?

What is it that they want? And what are those

obstacles that are getting in the way for

what that hero wants to get to? And the more

you kind of learn that rhythm, and you play

with words, you have your word bank, your

story bank, what Jane's talking about, the

better storyteller you'll be. And I mean,

I mean, let's just think about the last election

story. Usually people say the ones with the

best stories win at the end of the day.

Oh my gosh. It was John Quincy Adams who

said whoever tells the best story wins. But

there was a marketing guru, and I can't remember

who it was, who said whoever tells the most

stories wins. But having a structure actually

helps you draw meaning. And isn't that what

we're doing for our clients? They're telling

us, and then this happened, and this happened,

and this happened. And we're reflecting back

the bigger picture of the meaning. And we're

reflecting back their identity in a way.

We're helping them move into that aspirational

identity because we're going, oh, you're

a survivor. Or, oh, here's your strength.

Yeah. But the only way you can get them to

that point is using a story structure, because

story is so clear, right? You want them to

be able to see so clearly that journey that

they're on, or the journey that you've been

in, so that the transformational payoff right

we're talking about like a payoff of that

make I mean if you think about oh man we

could do it like I mean like the payoff the

payoff the payoffs are so sweet yeah when

the story is clearly told I mean the count

of Monte Cristo like the payoff of that of

the sweet revenge that he gets or like I

actually love Kill Bill like The payoff is

so great because they spent two movies getting,

she's, Uma Thurman's just working through

all these obstacles to getting finally to

Bill to finally kill him.

Right.

Like, uh, the payoff of, of, um, top gun,

right? I mean, yeah, there's just so much

of that on storytelling. So the more you're

able to clearly have a follow the structure,

so you can be clear, the payoff is going

to be better for anyone who's listening to

your marketing materials.

And I'll end on what you said, what we've

said a few times. Just start telling them.

Just start telling them. Tell little tiny

stories. Tell big epic stories. Just practice,

practice, practice. Notice them. Yeah. And

even like, oh, this is such a meta moment.

Uh-oh, we're gone. We're good.

We're good. We're good.

Even I take this from Priya Parker, who's

a gathering expert. She says, what's the

story of just of what just happened here?

What's the story of what we did here in this

gathering? And it's a question that you could

ask at the end of a session, but I'm thinking,

oh, we just had an interaction that hopefully

helps people draw the meaning out from what

they're doing in a way that helps others

see the value of it through stories.

Yeah, yeah. Well, let's end there. Let's

get, let me show this screen here so people

can get, you know, how they can get in touch

with you. JaneCarterCoaching.com.

Yes.

Is that the best?

That's the best, that's the best way to reach

me. And I have a free resources page. And

okay, so today is Monday, Tuesday, the 25th,

I will have my new story bank freebie up.

I wasn't, I didn't realize this was going

to be a live thing, but I also have some

other freebies up, so feel free to get those.

You'll get on my email list and you'll get

to hear all my little weekly nerdy, funny

stories that teach you insights for your

business. So yeah, this is so fun to be here.

Thank you so much. And thanks for everyone

for your questions and your feedback. Yeah.

All very good questions. Again, you'll get

an email at the replay. And thank you, Jane,

so much for joining us. And thank you, everyone,

for joining us for the joining me for the

Brand Your Practice podcast. And we look

forward to seeing you in the next one. All

right. Thank you so much.

Thank you.